Podcast Episode 93 Transcript

Episode 93: All About Digital Real Estate With Winston Robson

Are you ready to bring your real estate game to the next level? My name is James Prendamano. I'm the CEO and founder of PreReal. And over the past 25 years, I've closed over a billion dollars in transactional real estate. Each week, a meeting with outstanding investment investors, highperforming individuals and visionaries operating in the real estate space. These are the people that are actually out there in the real estate game right now. Getting it Done this podcast aims at bringing anyone's game to the next level. This is the Prereal Podcast. Welcome, everyone, to the Prereal Podcast. We're joined today by Winston Robson. He is the CEO and cofounder of WeMeta. So WeMeta. Essentially, they're the Premier platform for digital real estate where you can buy, sell, manage NFT land. We were doing some homework on them here in the shop and a couple of people had said they're kind of the Zillow for digital real estate. We're super pumped to talk to him. Winston, thank you so much for taking time out of the day to join us today. James, thanks so much for having me. It's going to be fun. Yeah, no doubt. So everybody is talking about the NFT craze. Everybody seems to at least now have a base of knowledge, and I think that's probably a good place for us to start. But before we get into what is an NFT and those basics, you're a young guy. The company is young. It was just formed in 2021. You've had wicked success. Congrats. By the way, I know you just closed out a raise over a million dollar raise. That's amazing stuff. How did you end up in the NFT land and the digital real estate world, if you will. What's the background? Yeah, it's a bit of a story. I dropped out of College to do a real estate startup. Actually, I wanted to do buying and selling houses on your cell phone. The reason I thought that would be successful is I just done a commercial real estate internship in London. And I had thought that I understand that my boss did most of his dealings on his cell phone, but it was sending an email calling somebody, looking at different listings, comparing different listings. And we're working in commercial real estate. But I'm like, you know, I spend a lot of time on my cell phone, too. I'm spending a lot of time on Zillow, actually looking at different places, trying to figure out where I wanted to live after College, I go back. I was studying at the University of Arkansas at the time. And for whatever reason, I convinced myself that the move was to do this app. And I wanted to move out to California. And it was fantastic. And so I studied real estate, a little bit of Cogn for about a semester, skipped all my classes, and May left, said I'm never coming back, got out to California. Turns out somebody else already has the app. They had $8 million in the bank. And that's when I learned how you do market research and why you do market research. Because I couldn't go back at that point. So I'm just out of luck here in San Francisco, which is an interesting spot to be in as the 19 year old with no responsibilities or ties, I just started selling houses in the Bay Area there for a while. I did that for a couple of years. I was really dissatisfied with the lack of data and understanding that I could provide to people because again, coming from Arkansas, where let's say 700 Kwh, just have anything you want, any neighborhood, walk into it. You got 700K. Probably pick your house, honestly. Then I go to San Francisco, where 700K, maybe if you're lucky, advise you the dumpster behind someone else's shed underneath like a ten storey building. Right. And so it was just to me, I couldn't comprehend it. And I was trying to wrap my head around it. And so I started pulling data. I started actually collecting data because I was trying to code that app way back. And so I'm like, why? Then I can figure out how to code some sort of thing that collects data. And so I just started collecting data from my own website, other websites, just simple Python web scraping stuff. Right. It got more complicated than that. But that's where it started and made these reports. And real estate was all right. But it wasn't exactly my niche. I wasn't selling to the right market. I wasn't in the right location. Maybe I could have moved to Oakland and it would have gone better. But I decided instead to go to Galvanize in San Francisco, which is a tech school. I learned data science there, about a four or five month program I actually had gone to previous October as well. So I actually did it over six or seven months. Really took my time and tried to understand everything and apply it. And then after the program, I ended up teaching there. I was leaving a whole bunch of workshops, classes with some people from Nvidia was one of them. And they spoke about Rapids, which is this big data warehousing solution. And so it runs all these huge queries. It takes like a 20 hours query in five minutes, and it runs on GPUs. Fantastic. I started talking and writing about that, went to Blazing SQL as a data scientist for a while, and then started up coding data science program. But during all that, I didn't feel like I was missing real estate. Interestingly. While I'm working on this really cool data stuff, it's just like, Where's the connection? And so the education programs for Currencies are we in a stable spot. I quit my job, went snowboarding for a month, and then started doing hackathon because I had some friends who wanted me to get into Blockchain Summit near Summit chain link. And essentially for people who don't know, a hackathon is where you show up to it's kind of a competition. It's kind of just a good time. And you come up with an idea and you code it or you find you identify a problem and you try to code a solution. And so I'm actually living in a Chad in Las Vegas at this time, which was really a lot of fun until it started heating up in the summer, let me tell you. And then it turned to not a lot of fun very quickly. And so I'm doing a lot of hackathons, and I come across this team at Web Three Weekend. And the initial idea there's these games that I learned about right then actually that weekend. And it's like there's a thing called the Sintra, and it is a video game that has 90,000 parcels which is considered their land. And that's the entire space of Decentraland. And it's essentially just a map that's been cut up to 300 by 300 grid. And you can buy one of those parcels and you can build anything you want on it. And so that was introduced to me. And I'm like, wow, I kind of heard about them at past. I've heard about the central end of the initial channeling tax on that I went to. And so I'm like, you know what? I'll check it out. And the idea was just to have a place shortly after that where you can compare the central land. Sandbox, ominous, basic crypto boxes. And what I left out there was shortly after that I was introduced to the different worlds. Sandbox, ominous, basic crypto boxes. These are the big school at that time. And it's like, wouldn't it be great to have a place where you can compare all these four actually make decisions and understand the difference? Right. And so that's essentially what we kind of built out that weekend. Specifically, it focused just on the central end because a much more advanced and easier platform to plug into. And from there, we've really scaled it to focus a lot more on data and providing people the best data to make informed decisions with their members purchases. I guess that's how I started moving up. Was there any influences or anybody in your life at that point that was involved in real estate, or was this a totally new gig for you when I dropped out of College? Yeah. My half sister is a commercial real estate broker, has a broker's license. I don't think she works bad. She's an executive now or something at Call Yours.

Okay. I reached out to some people. I like emailed people. And so I guess if you consider, like, cold email contacts as part of your life. I had cold email contacts. I had some who are in mortgage broking. And then before I went to the UK, I actually worked for a financial firm. And so they got the gist that I want to do this real estate thing. They introduced me to some really successful MLOs. And so I want to be MLO for a while. Mortgage broker or mortgage banker, really. And I'm like, it's just not my gig. The real reason for me, though, was once I had to start doing it, theoretically, it's all fine. And from a business aspect, I probably like the mortgage is better. But when it comes down to making individual sales, real estate agents get paid two and a half to three. X. What a mortgage broker? And I'm like, well, I have no contacts here. I have nobody who I can say, hey, you're looking to buy a house, right? That's like the first step, number one is when you get into real estate, get up all your contacts, let them know your real estate agent. Yada, yada. It's like I have no network out here. So we're starting from zero. Do I want number one to be at 1% or two and a half percent? And I want it to be at two and a half percent. Therefore, I chose real estate mortgages. Got it. So I don't want to bore the audience with what does this term mean? What does that term mean? I wanted to kind of jump in and talk about it because I think this is the next frontier. I think it's wicked exciting. I think that there are a lot of parallels between buying a piece of land in the real world, if you will, and buying a piece of land on the central land, sandbox, any one of those platforms. So when you go to the WeMeta website, there are similar to the way we list properties. It has details about the location, distance to the road or tiles from the road, the amount of distance or tiles to a district, and the price for it. Is it listed in Ethereum on your side? Is that how you guys do it? Yes. It's a complicated question. Mostly Ethereum. We support Ethereum Worlds right now. So you can buy all the Ethereum, but the price is actually listed in whatever the seller wants to list it in. Right now, they're enabled to do that in maybe five different currencies, like sand for sandbox, Mana for the central land. You could do Cube for some names, space, Ethereum. Obviously, these are all Ethereum based worlds. Usdc on Ethereum, die on Ethereum for stablecoins. And so those are the different currencies it could be listed in right now. So are you selling plots of lands for the platforms or for individuals who have acquired these plots already and they're now secondary market selling them? I'm sorry, what was the first question? So when you go onto your site and let's say I want to buy something into central land, and I say, okay, it's parcel 6214 06:00 A.m.. I buying that piece from another third party seller, someone like me, or are these parcels that are being sold or NFTs that are being sold from the original platform, from the central land itself. Yeah. So right now we're more of a secondary market in that sense where we're selling from you, from peer to peer. Essentially, in the future, we will have the central land or whoever that game is selling those and doing their initial land offerings with us right now. There haven't been any that we've been working with that have done a land release while we've been working with them. But this June, July. All right. So certain real estate principles that apply in the practical world, the real world. And I think that they also apply in the digital world. So location, right. Location, location, location. I think that also applies here. So if you're looking to acquire for those that are looking at this completely from the abstract and don't understand what we're talking about, think about, folks, if you're buying a piece on Highland Boulevard in Staten Island or you're buying a piece on Fifth Avenue. Right. That's going to carry one price point versus if you're going and you're buying something on Hunter Avenue or one of the non main back streets that feed fit the Avenue in Manhattan. So there are districts right. Where there is a lot of activity in the game. Is that a fair statement?

Sorry, I don't know why I district 100% where a lot of activity is happening. Okay. So the districts, folks are like our Highland Boulevard. It's like our Fifth Avenue. So people, we've been talking about this for a while internally, Winston, and as we've kind of gone through the process, we get the objections of we don't get it. Why would anybody ever see or what's the value of the land? And the way I try to explain it and I think I'm right and stop me at any time if I'm wrong. But if people are in this gaming environment and there's stats that are available, folks, for the central land, sandbox and so on, Superworld crypto, the other crypto boxes. Thank you. Crypto Voxels. So the same way that we have stats like traffic counts. Right. If we're buying a commercial piece of property, we want to know how many cars are passing the property every day. There are stats available in the game of how many users are logging in to that game at any given time. And what you're gaining there is that's the captive audience. Right. If you buy an NF 2% or this piece of real estate, because it's pretty goddamn close to tangible real estate as far as I'm concerned at this point. And you know, the people that are logging in, you know how many people are logging in? I would assume that there's all sorts of data available, Winston, do you know what the average age is of the player? Are you able to get into that kind of detail? Yeah. So I would say right now that data is not available for most digital real estate. That's the number one problem we as we met are trying to solve right now is how do you actually collect this information so that people who are managing their properties can understand who showed up. Right now, we have a client that we work with. They're actually an investor of ours who owns about 5% of a very popular virtual world. And they have absolutely no clue who visits their property. They're getting thousands, tens of thousands of visitors a day, no clue who those people are. And so we started collecting data on that, doing customer segmentation for them right now. I can't give you any specific details on the podcast, but that is a problem we're trying to solve. And if you look at a lot of our listings soon, they'll actually have stats like this available for everybody. So I wasn't even talking about visiting the individual parcel. That is insane. If you're able to pinpoint who is visiting the parcel. I meant stats on who are the players, who are the users of the central end, who are the users of Sandbox? I would assume that date is available. Right. Average age group and so on. How long they're on the game for? Not really. Really. Yeah. It's kind of crazy. And so it is interesting that you call that out now. It's like we've chosen to focus a level deeper, but as getting to level deeper, we're also able to surface the top level. A lot of this right now is because they're signing in with the crypto wallets. How do you tell who I am with the crypto wallet? So there needs to be some way to kind of trace that back. What we're working on mostly is like player behavior. What are the behavior patterns? Who's into what? How long are they staying? What are they interested in? And so I think as we build that out, we'll be able to solve these more high level questions as well. So if I wanted to acquire an NFT in any one of these platforms, is there a way to research or verify who owns surrounding parcels? Yes, you can look at their wallet address. Certainly there's a lot of bigger players whose wallet address is more public or in, say, the Sandbox. They actually allow you to say visually on the map what land you own. And so you'll notice there's like a big Snoop Dogg section. There's an open sea section. There's rarely. And other people as well who put their logo on the map. And so in Sandbox, is it quite easy. They're very easy to get in the central lands. They should have to do a bit more digging. So I would think if this is essentially advertising. Right. The reason we were interested in acquiring a piece we trademarked prereal. We're going to scale. Right. We want to open up in multiple cities and backstop it with a raise. But we felt that if we were able to open up, like, even for now, if we built prereal health centers where people can literally in the virtual world drop by and ask any kind of real estate questions, just a free place that people can come and maybe host some talks out of it, offer free information. If people had questions and brand ourselves in the game, we're actually able to build like a virtual building. Right. Like a prereal health center. We can do that 100%. I have a few recommendations for how you might go about it, if you're interested. And if people wanted to come and ask a question, are we allowed to ask them to leave their email address or a way to correspond with them? 100%? Yeah, certainly. Okay. So, folks, if you're able to acquire this location, you're able to determine because on some of the maps, you'll actually see where the roads are. And now they're open platform so players can go kind of wherever they want on the map. But most people tend to travel along the roads. They hang around the districts. And where there's a concentration of players, you've got a better chance of being seen being visible if you're closer to those areas. And the prices, from what I understand, commensurately go up. Right. Significantly, the closer to the main districts. That's a bit complicated. So that varies world to world. Right now, in the future, I think it will as well. But you're going to see key points of interest, KPIs and so right now in the central land, the Genesis Plaza land around there is incredibly expensive and difficult to find acquire anything you wanted, even if you wanted to, say rent. It's just hard to get the opportunity. And so that's why land around, say, Genesis Plaza into central and is very expensive. You have some other districts, for example, Vegas fashion district, our Vegas district in the fashion district. And then you have some places where larger investors are known to do events. And so those have a slight premium. And so that's a little bit. But as you go to say something like the sandbox, it's more where is Snoop Dogg's house? Snoop Dogg's house could be in the bottom left corner. But right now that's a huge demand for sandbox. The land around Snoop Dogg goes up. And so these locations can change a little bit, like how they do in real life. But in real life, it may take 50 or 100 or 20 years or whatever. And the sandbox, let's say the US government comes in and buys a huge plot of land area, land around that would shoot up to the roof immediately. Right. Or let's say some huge real estate developers did. So then in some namespace, it's a bit all over the map, essentially. Right now it's more determined about access. And so there's like kayaks and some names, there are cars. There's different things you can do to have a great time and so areas around places that enable you to do that. For example, land on an island or land near water does go up. But other than that, it's just kind of random. And the same with the central land and sandbox where it's like, other than those points of interest, it varies. There's not necessarily a huge decline, but it's just kind of more average, if that makes sense. But these worlds still need to be built out. And so as these worlds build out, I do think the theory of location mattering could become more valid. It's just right now, nobody knows where those locations are. So from a branding perspective. Right. For me, it sure as hell will matter if I know that a bunch of people are going to go check out Snoop's house or they're going to go check out the fashion district or whatever it may be. I'm paying for eyeballs. That's the way I see it. I'm paying for exposure eyeballs in the short term. In the long term, this is an investment like anything else is. Now, you have said you can rent it. I didn't realize that. So you can acquire and rent your parcel. Yeah. It's actually something we'll be spending up on our website soon. Right now, you'd have to do it like a traditional deal, sign a piece of paper with somebody. But I have a buddy who's leased me their land in Central land. I've leased people land in some namespace. That's how you build on it, actually. You just lease it to the person who's going to deploy the scene or work on the scene. Some namespace, the Centralland both have foundational infrastructure to enable you to do this without having to, say, send them your NFT. You can just add them as a controller or something like that. Or transfer. Yeah, it's mostly the controller title. And so these are things that the games themselves are thinking about as well and deploying because they see this land as having extreme value. And so you want to monetize it in ways other than selling it. Right. And so you can definitely rent it out. Wow, it's crazy. It's amazing. If we can kind of walk through it, I want to open up pre rail help centers. Right. So I contact you guys. Are you able to walk us through, give us suggestions, explain to us where it is? Or is this for kind of the higher level investor in NFTs? And you kind of click and that's what you're buying and that's the experience. Do you guys cater to someone like me that's just getting their feet wet and looking to find a specific location or what is the interface like? I like helping people, so whatever helps people would certainly be down to help you. Are you talking more about the interface for our website? So I want to do this. We're poised to do this. And there was no way for us to find someone to help us through the process. So we went, I got you, bro. For us, it was a challenging process, getting the wallet set up and the passcodes that you could never lose and all of this nuttiness, right. But it was not secondary. It was not a second nature to us. It was an arduous process. So we get through that. And now we want to buy a lot. We don't know much about the games, the traffic, where, how, why. So when we come to your site, do we have the ability to speak to someone that if I say, hey, I want to open up a prereal help center or I want to open up something completely different? Do you guys interact that way and say, oh, you know where it may be a great idea if you did it over here and here's the partials we have. Is that part of the experience? Yeah, that's exactly what we're building out. That's exactly what we're building out. We can talk about it more offline. But like, right now, if anybody has those sorts of questions, give me an email, give me a call. I got you been through that pain. I'm almost sorry that you had to experience all of it, but it's the early people who experience all that that are going to make a better experience for people later on. And I think there certainly needs to be a more streamlined process to onboarding people like yourself. Even these larger brands come in. I mean, don't feel terrible. You're kind of in a similar spot to say Nike is him or whoever else wants to get in. It's just they have more resources. Right. They have more teams. They have people who are focused. They can go hire somebody to figure this out, right? Yeah. And so they go get some whiz kid out of College or something. Right. And so there needs to be a platform where you can see all these different experiences that are going on and be like, hey, this is a really good experience. If you wanted to do something similar, here's the tools you need. And that's exactly what we're building out right now. This is remarkable, man. Thank you. We're going to come to the site. You're going to walk us through. We're going to acquire a piece of land. Okay. Now what on the platforms are there limited amount of parcels that's established now where, let's say the central land is 90,000 plots? Do they cap it like, is it, hey, we've got 90,000 plots. That's all we're going to have. Or they do. So this is complicated

in the sandbox. Smart contracts that determine their land and how you meant it. It's written into the contract that the map is 408 by 408. That comes out to like 166K parcels or whatever. Right. In the central land. It's not actually in the contract, but it seems to be agreed upon. And then their Dow could theoretically pass something to add more land. The reason they wouldn't want to do that is because it would dilute the current land holders right now. And right now, the Decentral End Foundation actually owns about 70% of the central land still. And so, I mean, Sandbox still owns a significant portion of Sandbox base still owns a significant portion of Somnium. And they've been releasing these things as the game is ready, as people are willing to buy in because they don't want to sell it to anybody. That's a really concerned that you just sell all your land and all of a sudden nobody uses it. Right? Right. And so it is cap. But something really interesting that's going on right now is Crypto Voxels. Actually, last summer they were a platform about 6000 parcels. They slowly creeped that up to about 9000. And then they recently announced a plan to take it all the way to $90,000. And frankly, I think it's going to transform the game. I'm really excited to see what they do with it. I think it was necessary. Their community was kind of stagnant, and that's just what it boiled down to. They did really well with getting these art galleries early on so people could display their NFTs. And a lot of people you talk to OG when I say OG, but now, I mean, like three, four years in Crypto, maybe five years now. And so they have these NFTs that are like really cool, and they want to show them off to their friends. Cryptovoxos is a great place to do that. Now Crypto Voxels needs to become something more. And so part of doing that was they actually increased their land amount. Now, I will say they were one 15th the size of the central mind as far as number of parcels, and then like one 30th the size of Sandbox. So their increase puts them more in this competitive range of how many parcels their land has. And so it's not an impossibility that people increase the amount of land they have. It's just unlikely. And then in some cases, it's actually coded in that they can't. Does that make sense? Yeah, it absolutely makes sense. And while the terminology and the in practice how this plays out, it's obviously different. But the core principles are exactly the same as investing in real estate. You're looking at traffic counts, you're looking at a targeted audience, you're looking at being in an area where potentially there's more activity. You're talking about the same inherent rights, the ability to rent and or develop, the ability to display, like you had said, promoting if you've got some really neat, limited NFT drops from a couple of years ago, there's some really neat things out there. It's a reason and a place to drive, folks, if you're not in the business like I am. Yeah, I would say humbly speaking and understanding that we're just playing a small role in this. But we met is here to help that transformation happen. Because two, three, four years ago, this was all speculative. It was just like, there's this game. It's called the central land. They release land. If you actually were in the know, like you're an investor level, perhaps you comprehended it, but everybody else is just like, you buy it, it goes up. And so now we're seeing where you actually look at the traffic counts, you actually look at what you can do with the land. And so that's what we're here to do as a company, essentially. Amazing. So we acquire the parcel. Now we want to build it. Do you guys make recommendations or is there a process where you point us to who and how and why? Yeah. So right now this is like something that we're just starting to tackle. What we've been doing is saying, hey, we know some great builders over here. We have some great builders over here. I would go to that guy. He built basically all the land for their entire built all the different buildings for our community. Or go to this guy, he actually built our plot or go to this lady, she does whatever. Right. And so that's how we've been doing it. There are these 3D marketplaces popping up and sort of like, it's interesting. I want to say prefab opportunities, prefabricated for anybody who doesn't know it's already mostly built out buildings that you can customize slightly that fit your parcels in different ways. And so how the next year will look as those will start to pop up and become more popular, there's also going to be more people doing custom builds, and we'll see how it looks in the future. But I think builders are the most important part and the most critical aspect to actually turning this into something real, if that makes sense, it makes perfect sense. And again, the parallels to investing in traditional real estate, it's astounding right. If you're buying a prefab, there are certain limitations, and there are certain things that come along with a prefab unit, not anything wrong with it. And then when you're building customs, prefab. Yeah, right. There are certain advantages and disadvantages to building customs. So again, the parallels are pretty remarkable. So we come to your site, we acquire the piece, you walk us through the entire transaction. We get referred out to a builder. Are there rules, like, are there, like, design criteria or other things you have to adhere to if you wanted to improve your NFP? Yeah. Let's take the central land, for example, the height that you can build up to. The more parcels you have combined into something called an estate, the higher you can build, the more compelling of an experience. In my opinion, you can build as well. I don't know. There's some crazy things that are smaller. And so it's almost like real life. If you have this huge like, if you got a football field, you can build an office building. Right. If you got like a quarter acre, you can build a two story house. The height you need more land, and then it allows you to build taller experiences. We work with Jamestown, actually, they did a Times Square ball drop into Central, and I think it was the tallest building at that point. And the size of that estate was 170 parcels. So just like, again, traditional real estate, the more land you have, the more far or floor area ratio that's available to build, allowing you to have a taller yield or a larger yield. This is remarkable stuff. It really is. It is so exciting. And again, the issue that we had, and I think a lot of people were having, is you're really solving for it. That break between getting it set up and trying to understand how to navigate the world and how do you convert to Mana and how do you convert to these different currencies? Right. It's a lot for those that didn't weren't in on this from Jumpstreet. So I think this thing is going to freaking explode, man. Wicked exciting. So you guys, do you know, from a tax perspective, how are these transactions treated? Are there capital gains? I can't imagine, but maybe there are other capital gains when you're trading NFDS? Yeah, I would say, first and foremost, I'm not an accountant. I have outsourced my accountant to, like, I hired the accounting firm, and I'm not even trading at super high volume NFC. So first and foremost, ask your account master lawyers. I know that I would assume you buy an NFC, you sell it a couple of years later or like a currency or anything. You're going to see a capital gains tax. You sell it faster than that. You're probably going to see a short term gains tax or just taxes income, right? Yeah. So thinking of it that way, has anybody explored the prospect of acquiring NFTs to shelter your gains on the way in? So let's say someone is selling an office building, right? If you're doing, like, a 1031 exchange, it's a, like, kind exchange. It's pretty limited. I can't imagine that allowing you to play in the NFC world, but I don't know. Are you guys familiar with opportunity zones? Oz? No, I'm familiar with so Oz are far more flexible. You can Oz if you sell your wine collection the same way you can Oz if you sell your real estate building. I'm wondering if what is an Oz? So an Oz basically is they took districts that had historically high unemployment, and they created these zones where they incentivize you to take your money and invest in those areas. So unlike 1031 exchange, where your money gets put into a trustees account, you never touch it. You have to find a lie kind exchange and dollar for dollar back into the next transaction. An Oz is very different. You're actually allowed to take the money very simple to get set up as a qualified opportunity fund at QOF. It's basically a one form registration that an accountant can handle. You're allowed to take the money in. And now if you invest it in theOz, there's several benefits. The first benefit is you do not pay tax until 2026. So you have your hands on the full capital up until 2026, depending on when you make the acquisition. You also get discounts. So if you had $100,000 tax exposure, I think the minimum one is 15%. You're saving 15 grand when it becomes 2026, and you have to invest money into improving the parcel or the building or whatever it is you've acquired over time. They want you to create jobs. So what we theoretically could do is we can set up almost like a VC. And we were thinking about doing this for other tech initiatives where we acquire a piece of property in an Oz and we have a start up, or we have a company that locates in theOz. We're allowed to invest in that company and any profits the company makes if you stay for ten years, is tax free, wait for the investor or for the company. So you're investing in the company. So your dividend is tax free for there for ten years because they need to take up the space of theOz. So I'm wondering if there's a way that you can locate office infrastructure in an Oz and take in Oz money that is otherwise getting taxed and have people start placing it in these NFTs bro. That would be. That would be next level. And I'd say certainly something we're working on is like void analysis. Instead tailors towards these Oz. To a certain extent, you'd have to slightly adjust it, but it's like, where are theOz and the Meta roof? And then can we get said tax authorities to say, like, this is Oz? That'd be interesting. Yeah. And if not in the lands or the Metaverse, if not in these individual games, locating your company in Oz would allow you to take those investments and deploy them and still be sheltered. I have a wicked, wicked good Oz accountant. I'm going to speak to him and see if there's a prospect for doing that. If there is, that is amazingly powerful. Certainly. Yeah. Let me know how the condo goes. That sounds fine. Yeah, 100%. So, I mean, anytime as real estate investors, we have an opportunity to shelter again. It's all about efficiency, right? You guys are like I had said, you had a successful raise already. Are there any limitations on the States that you're allowed to operate in? What does that look like right now? We're operating as a Delaware C Corp. So anywhere you couldn't do Delaware C Corp, got it. I'd say there's avenues that we're exploring. Like, if we start to fractionalizing land, I'm pretty sure we couldn't sell that to us citizens. Got it. And the best way, like, I could keep you on for ever in a day. I know you've got another one coming up but what's the best way for folks to find you? Me? I'm on Twitter as dumb drop Steve the company is we met a tweet on Twitter or we met a world is our website. We push website updates more frequently than we tweet. Actually at this point we're working on adjusting that partially but right now we're in build mode so it's just push push, push on the website. I'd say keep up with the website for sure. So folks, of course, as always the links will be below but it's weamed world definitely go check out the website and you'll see similar to our website these listings come up. It gives a parcel ID. It gives you the amount of spaces from the road the amount of spaces from the district, the price and a whole bunch of other information. Winston, this has been fascinating. I think you guys are on to something that is absolutely going to transform the industry in a really significant way. I'm super excited for it. We're definitely going to be in touch. Like I said, we're about to dip our toe in the water here anyway so all the best man. Congratulations on the success and thank you when you're in new York. Okay. I will absolutely. This has been a ton of fun. I really appreciate you having me really fascinating conversation. I think especially as we got into the more technicalities between how these things could be similar that's uncharted water. So I'm really excited to me. Thanks so much for having me on this. It's a lot of fun. My absolute pleasure. Winston Robson. Everybody, as always please stay safe.